The Chosen Ones

Off-Topic => Questionnaire => Topic started by: liauyuancheng on September 16, 2012, 12:00:16 pm


Title: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on September 16, 2012, 12:00:16 pm
Last played 1.8e and here's my comments.

1: Poor
2: Fair
3: Average
4: Good
5: Excellent

1) Gameplay - What do you think about the game play. For example, are the abilities, items and spells fine? Is there too much killing? Is the campaign too repetive?

3/5

+ve points - Spells, abilities and items are very diverse and creative, with cool graphics and pretty useful functionality. I enjoyed using as many of them as possible.

-ve points - Spells could have been more diverse still. Try to have at least 4 spells per category per hero for selection. For example, Galeoth healing spell only has 2 possible selections. Effects like stagger, bleed and brittle should be included in every ability that can hurt enemies via buff used and buff given, so that they can play a better role in spell choosing and create more synergy. Abilities like combat kings are useful but I don't know when they will take effect so I cannot judge if they are worth the honour points. Exception is resurrection. Items can be improved: fix spelling, grammatical and expression errors, include a short quirky comment/ brief background for all items (only some has this now), be clearer with how the abilities in the item works (e.g. occasionally summons a blast that heals allies for jade set - what do you mean by occasionally?), fix wrong item titles and banned items

2) Terrain - What do you think about the terrain? Is it eye candy or not? What you believe is the most beautiful place and what should be improved.

4.5/5

+ve points - Terrain is very stunning. Rarely I see a map with much thought put into designing terrain. Keep up the good work!

-ve points - Terrain leaks in chapter 8 in the last version I played! Hope you fixed that already with the latest version.

3) Atmosphere - What do you think about the atmosphere of the campaign? Too funny? Too sad? And does the music make the atmosphere better?

4/5

+ve points - Much thought has been put into creating a balance between funny, downright stupid, serious, sad and angryish atmosphere. Careful choice of music that suits the atmosphere of the map and events. Keep it up!

-ve points - Please remove vulgarities and sexual connotations from this map because I dont think we need to use them to advance the plot or make things funny. And do fix the music bug in the bug masterthread.

4) Story - What do you think about the story. Is too simple or confusing? Is it mysterious and complicated enough? What is your favorite character?

Cant really judge here as I dont know the full story. Now, it's looking good, with many different subtleties, mysteries and angles and issues to consider.

5) Cinematics - What do you think about the cinematics. Tell what is the worst and the best cinematic and why.

3/5

+ve points - Very good characterisation you have there going for the three main characters due to the cinematics.

-ve points - Fix spelling, grammatical and expression errors. Cut down on unnecessary texts that repeat ideas for long cinematics. A voice-over will be a bonus. Cut down the time taken for each wall of text to disappear cause I don't read that slow. As said, do remove all sexual connotations and vulgarities cause I dont believe you need them to make something funny. Sometimes I cant skip cinematics, especially at the beginning of each chapter :(

6) Bosses - What do you think about the bosses at the campaign? Are they challenging, balanced, different and unique enough? What is your favourite boss and what boss could need some improvements?

4/5

+ve points - Creative bosses with distinct spells and background stories! Loved them all so keep this up! :)) Challenging and balanced enough for me!

-ve points - Some animations for spells shouldnt be reused, e.g. the shockwave animation. And do fix the bugs regarding bosses in the bug masterthread. xD My opinion is that more spells should be added to bosses when we proceed on with the chapters and when we play on harder difficulties. Events could have happened in a shorter span of time between events.

7) Diffculty - What is your opinion about the difficulties. Do you think the difficulties are balanced enough or do they need improvements?

Cannot comment as I have only played on Easy haha

8) All things consired, how would you describe your playing experience at the campaign? What could be done better and what you believe doesn't anymore need attension?

Very entertaining, I truly enjoyed every moment of my gaming experience, except the bugs. One of the best high quality maps I have ever played! :)

Wishlist:
- Potions should be transferrable between levels.
- More creeps per map; but dont make then able to respawn
- Vitality system and spell book upgrades to come back
- 1 new profession, maybe mining as I have suggested earlier?
- Achievement system and weather system as suggested before
- Fix all bugs! And make the campaign cleaner in terms of removing formatting and grammatical errors etc

9) Would you recommend this campaign to your friends?

Not yet; I will wait till the final version before promoting this to my friends.

If I miss out anything, I'll edit this later.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Doomlord on September 16, 2012, 04:51:46 pm
Quote
Spells could have been
more diverse still. Try to have at
least 4 spells per category per hero
for selection. For example, Galeoth
healing spell only has 2 possible
selections.
We welcome new spell ideas all the time. The only matter is the members' willingness to contribute.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Pourquoi on September 17, 2012, 12:26:32 am
Quote
Items can be improved: fix spelling, grammatical and expression errors, include a short quirky comment/ brief background for all items (only some has this now)
Where? I'd want to know. I fixed most of the descriptions some versions ago.
About the flavour texts, not all items can have it. Some descriptions are too long, and there's also a cap of 498 letters per description. And Aero is really, really odd about that: he prefers lame jokes to funny jokes.
Quote
be clearer with how the abilities in the item works (e.g. occasionally summons a blast that heals allies for jade set - what do you mean by occasionally?)
Aero wants the game to be playable by everyone, including complete idiots, so he opted to make the descriptions very simple - perhaps too simple.
Quote
Please remove vulgarities and sexual connotations from this map because I dont think we need to use them to advance the plot or make things funny.
Fradz has been using Aero's computer.
Quote
A voice-over will be a bonus.
However, voice takes a huge amount of space, and I don't think anyone would want longer loading times...
Quote
Vitality system and spell book upgrades to come back
Vitality messes with selling prices, so Aero had to remove it. And he's just too lazy to add the spell book upgrades at the moment.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on September 17, 2012, 01:52:03 am
Quote from: liauyuancheng
Please remove vulgarities and sexual connotations from this map because I dont think we need to use them to advance the plot or make things funny.
I don't remember any vulgarities or sexual connotations. Where are those?

Quote from: liauyuancheng
Cut down on unnecessary texts that repeat ideas for long cinematics
Like where?

Quote from: liauyuancheng
Cut down the time taken for each wall of text to disappear cause I don't read that slow.

Yea, well I know this is a problem for some people. But we have to think about others too who don't read that fast. Also, it would take enormous time to change all the dialogues shorter...

Quote from: liauyuancheng
Sometimes I cant skip cinematics, especially at the beginning of each chapter
Will do something about this.

Quote from: liauyuancheng
Some animations for spells shouldnt be reused, e.g. the shockwave animation.
Once again, I want some examples.

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- Potions should be transferrable between levels.
But they are?

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- More creeps per map; but dont make then able to respawn
Where?

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- Vitality system and spell book upgrades to come back
Well, upgrades will come back as soon as I've finished all the spells. So in 1.9 with chapter 9.


Quote from: liauyuancheng
- 1 new profession, maybe mining as I have suggested earlier?
Oh, yea. But I fear like the mining is too similar to digging...  :(

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- Achievement system and weather system as suggested before
Archievements? Oh yes, I need to do this some day. We do have weather system already?

Quote from: Pourquoi
Fradz has been using Aero's computer.
Or Fradz is Aero.  ;)

Thanks for the big big feedback, liauyuancheng!!
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on September 17, 2012, 04:41:26 am
i agree on unnecessary texts repeating ideas for long cinematics. This and the slow text change times are what convinced me to skip every single cinematic :)

And potions are not transferrable between levels Aero.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Pourquoi on September 17, 2012, 05:22:35 am
Quote
Yea, well I know this is a problem for some people. But we have to think about others too who don't read that fast.
After my small analysis I found out that the average wpm of the texts in the campaign is around 140-150, which is too slow for most people, unless if you're trying to learn English through these texts, or reading the texts to memorise them. Maybe not the complete novices in English... but they cannot understand most of the texts anyway.
And I also know of a system of dynamic dialogue skipping in HeroRPG, but that map is protected...
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on September 17, 2012, 06:51:43 am
Dynamic skipping would be my dream come true.. and fixing repetition in dialogues of course :D
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on September 18, 2012, 02:06:01 am
And potions are not transferrable between levels Aero.

Not even scrolls?

Dynamic skipping would be my dream come true.. and fixing repetition in dialogues of course :D

If you guys want this to go forward better start throwing some examples.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on September 18, 2012, 04:30:45 am
Damn Aero, then I would have to start watching all the cutscenes again :(

Is there a quick way to read cutscenes from an unprotected map?

Anyway from memory the Omega Boss cutscene had that kind of simpleton repetition... its like when you want to give the watcher a hint about something, sometimes its repeated multiple times even though the first hint was enough. I'll root out some examples if you could help me with a method of reading cutscenes in world edit od something?
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Pourquoi on September 18, 2012, 07:50:22 am
Quote
Is there a quick way to read cutscenes from an unprotected map?
Yes, but you can only read the lines, you can't watch the cinematic itself.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on September 18, 2012, 09:46:06 am
Quote
Is there a quick way to read cutscenes from an unprotected map?
Yes, but you can only read the lines, you can't watch the cinematic itself.

That is all I want to be honest, how do I do it?

Thanks
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Pourquoi on September 18, 2012, 09:48:25 am
Quote
Is there a quick way to read cutscenes from an unprotected map?
Yes, but you can only read the lines, you can't watch the cinematic itself.

That is all I want to be honest, how do I do it?

Thanks
Open the unprotected campaign, find the cinematic triggers, and look for the ones that display 'Display XXX text for Y seconds'. Or something like that.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on September 18, 2012, 10:10:43 am
Quote
Is there a quick way to read cutscenes from an unprotected map?
Yes, but you can only read the lines, you can't watch the cinematic itself.

That is all I want to be honest, how do I do it?

Thanks
Open the unprotected campaign, find the cinematic triggers, and look for the ones that display 'Display XXX text for Y seconds'. Or something like that.

Oh I hoped there would be a more friendly method, that would take a bit of effort finding and clicking every one :(

Thanks though
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Flecky on September 18, 2012, 10:22:35 am
Oh I hoped there would be a more friendly method, that would take a bit of effort finding and clicking every one :(

The moment people discovered the trigger editor, it was to become clear that anything advanced or experienced made with it wouldn't be simple. Just like JASS.

Duh... But at least it adds to the possibilities.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on September 18, 2012, 01:57:00 pm
If I can get hold the JASS code produced by those triggers designed in GUI, I could actually make a script that extracts just all the cutscene texts in an instant..

possibilities!
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on September 21, 2012, 11:50:44 pm
Thx for the feedback! Some points to make:

- If voiceover will make the game load even slower, then I prefer faster loading times than voiceover. Anyway voiceover is just a bonus, not necessary.
- If I am not wrong, in chapter 5, there's a female villager who talks about Fradz's dick being very big and another who talks about the wild sex they had...
- Long cinematics like the convo with Tharo and dragon inside Fradz, Alfred and Phodom, and the optional cinematics in Chapters 7 and 8 tend to have repeating ideas.
- Jurxy and some minibosses use the shockwave animation, if I am right.
- Would love to have more creeps in Chapters 1, 2, 4, 5, 8 and especially 3

Some other comments to add on top of the questionnaire:
- Weather system: http://www.tcocampaign.com/index.php?topic=1184.0; (http://www.tcocampaign.com/index.php?topic=1184.0;) it has been discussed before but it isn't inside the game yet. Would love to have the environment placing +ve/-ve defuffs on the heroes and enemy units alike, with changing buffs once every hour? Also, the buffs should sort of suit the terrain the chapter is in.

- Bosses: Most of the bosses are difficult enough but Chapter 1 and 3 epic bosses, I find are too easy. For Chapter 1 epic boss, the boss tried to cast something while being invulnerable but nothing happened, making me killing him very easy. For Chapter 3 epic boss, it quite weird cause when he summons the spherical balls in a quarter of the arena, sometimes I get damaged sometimes I dont. And thats about the only spell he casted throughout the fight. So do revamp this boss in the next version.

- Scoreboard: Currently it bugs from Chapter 5 onwards. Bugs include not showing that I defeating elite and epic bosses, not showing that I have completed all main and optional quests and not showing that I digged all spots, stole from all possible monsters and collected all flowers. Sometimes also dont show the attack speeds. And there's alignment issues with the dmg indicator for spell book spells. Do fix that.

- Main issue with some optional quests and puzzles is that there's a general lack of hints or help given to complete them. Examples are the strange stones puzzle, finding Chapter 8 epic boss, Chapter 8 puzzle etc...

- Chapters: I would like to see a revamp of Chapter 2, 3 and 4 because they do not really advance the plot, just about heroes travelling from one place to another. Quite lame and uneventful... Would be better if the chapters were to change such that there will be more main quests that advance the plot. Also, I feel Chapter 3 needs urgent revamp because currently the map is so small, and there's virtually nothing much you can do in it. I suggest expanding the terrain, adding more monsters, main quests and optional quests, to make chapter 3 last longer and become more interesting. This will also allow players to level up Galeoth more.

Random question: Is there a puzzle in chapter 5? Scoreboard says yes but I cant find it.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Pourquoi on September 22, 2012, 12:24:32 am
Quote
Random question: Is there a puzzle in chapter 5? Scoreboard says yes but I cant find it.
There used to be one, but Aero removed it. And, since he almost never finishes anything 'properly', he did not remove it from the multiboard.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on September 22, 2012, 02:36:30 am
Some other ideas:

- I think every portal in the game should have a portal guardian to defeat before we can use it. Makes things more challenging :)
- Personally, I prefer 8 boxes for each character so that I will have more space for my items :D
- Any chance we can use honour points to upgrade our abilities we chose in prologue, just like the spell book upgrades (two choose one)? Would love that!
- I think we can have a mastery level for each ability, whereby there will be a good upgrade for each ability if it is used for X number of times and if the ability level hits lvl 10 and 20?
- Maybe we could have a system whereby items can be empowered using honour points, something like spell book upgrades (two choose one)?
- I wonder if the heroes actually have their own lines they say when they do different actions like walking, fighting, mediating and more actions etc. It'll be quite cool to have this!
- It will be also good to gain passive bonuses by fighting more creeps and fighting for longer periods of time without stopping, that way it will discourage hit and run tactics.
- Other than pressing on people to see floating texts, there could be areas whereby upon entering, there will be floating texts to show the thinking of the heroes.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Pourquoi on September 22, 2012, 05:47:03 am
Quote
- Maybe we could have a system whereby items can be empowered using honour points, something like spell book upgrades (two choose one)?
WC3 items, unlike Diablo ones, are hard coded and static. If you want to create 'upgrades' for items, then you have to make a new item for every upgrade, which can make the loading times even longer.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on September 22, 2012, 08:06:59 am
Awww that's sad... Anyway I was looking at all the threads in Idea Factory and I found several ideas quite good but not yet implemented. One of them was the idea of upgrading items... Well let's see if it will make loading times too long... Anyway is there any air units in TCO?

Thought of a new random idea. We can have each unit possibly dropping random items ranging from common to myth with low drop percentages. Then, we can have items that increases the chance of dropping any items and items that increases the chance of dropping rarer items, mainly item drop chance and item rarity chance. That will make the game more dynamic, I believe.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on September 22, 2012, 10:23:21 am
Awww that's sad... Anyway I was looking at all the threads in Idea Factory and I found several ideas quite good but not yet implemented. One of them was the idea of upgrading items... Well let's see if it will make loading times too long... Anyway is there any air units in TCO?

Thought of a new random idea. We can have each unit possibly dropping random items ranging from common to myth with low drop percentages. Then, we can have items that increases the chance of dropping any items and items that increases the chance of dropping rarer items, mainly item drop chance and item rarity chance. That will make the game more dynamic, I believe.

Nah makes it a grind IMO. And seeing as enemies don't respawn a lot of the time I can see it being frustrating
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on September 26, 2012, 01:21:09 am
First of all, don't worry about "making the loading time" longer. It won't go longer than it's currently are.

I'll answer to your second post later.

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- If voiceover will make the game load even slower, then I prefer faster loading times than voiceover.
Well, not really. The biggest problem is that the voiceover will ruin the atmosphere, it doesn't matter how good voice actors we'll have. I've never ever see a good voice acting in any Warcraft 3 game and believe me, I have played a lot of Warcraft 3 custom games.

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- If I am not wrong, in chapter 5, there's a female villager who talks about Fradz's dick being very big and another who talks about the wild sex they had...
Okay, haha. Will change that then.

Quote from: liauyuancheng
and the optional cinematics in Chapters 7 and 8 tend to have repeating ideas.
I'm not sure about these. There are many optional cinematics...

Quote from: liauyuancheng
Some other comments to add on top of the questionnaire:
- Weather system: http://www.tcocampaign.com/index.php?topic=1184.0; (http://www.tcocampaign.com/index.php?topic=1184.0;) it has been discussed before but it isn't inside the game yet. Would love to have the environment placing +ve/-ve defuffs on the heroes and enemy units alike, with changing buffs once every hour? Also, the buffs should sort of suit the terrain the chapter is in.
Yea I totally forgot this one.

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- Scoreboard: Currently it bugs from Chapter 5 onwards. Bugs include not showing that I defeating elite and epic bosses, not showing that I have completed all main and optional quests and not showing that I digged all spots, stole from all possible monsters and collected all flowers. Sometimes also dont show the attack speeds. And there's alignment issues with the dmg indicator for spell book spells. Do fix that.
You mean save/load bugs or I've simply forgot to add something to the multiboard?

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- Chapters: I would like to see a revamp of Chapter 2, 3 and 4 because they do not really advance the plot, just about heroes travelling from one place to another.
At this point, there's nothing to save them. Originall chapter 2, 3 were not in the campaign at all. What I can only to do those chapters is to give more "fillers".

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- I think every portal in the game should have a portal guardian to defeat before we can use it. Makes things more challenging :)
Portal...?

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- Personally, I prefer 8 boxes for each character so that I will have more space for my items :D
4 boxes not enough?

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- Any chance we can use honour points to upgrade our abilities we chose in prologue, just like the spell book upgrades (two choose one)? Would love that!
I don't know...



Quote from: liauyuancheng
- Maybe we could have a system whereby items can be empowered using honour points, something like spell book upgrades (two choose one)?
I think Synthesis is just enough.

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- I wonder if the heroes actually have their own lines they say when they do different actions like walking, fighting, mediating and more actions etc. It'll be quite cool to have this!

Well, help here: http://www.tcocampaign.com/index.php?topic=1081.0 (http://www.tcocampaign.com/index.php?topic=1081.0)

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- It will be also good to gain passive bonuses by fighting more creeps and fighting for longer periods of time without stopping, that way it will discourage hit and run tactics.
We have many items and abilities like that?

Quote from: liauyuancheng
- Other than pressing on people to see floating texts, there could be areas whereby upon entering, there will be floating texts to show the thinking of the heroes.
Well, possible. Would bring the world more alive, but of couse we have those cinematics already...

Quote from: liauyuancheng
Thought of a new random idea. We can have each unit possibly dropping random items ranging from common to myth with low drop percentages. Then, we can have items that increases the chance of dropping any items and items that increases the chance of dropping rarer items, mainly item drop chance and item rarity chance. That will make the game more dynamic, I believe.
The campaign is not build like Diablo; this is a single-player RPG where you exactly know where to obtain each item so you don't need to grind forever to obtain some specific items.

Quote from: liauyuancheng
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on September 26, 2012, 04:41:35 am
from about chapter 5 onwards the multiboard is wrong. It has errors like what the OP has said.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on September 26, 2012, 09:33:22 am
- "You mean save/load bugs or I've simply forgot to add something to the multiboard?" I honestly dont noe... i do load several times when fighting bosses so ya...
- "At this point, there's nothing to save them. Originall chapter 2, 3 were not in the campaign at all. What I can only to do those chapters is to give more "fillers"." Please do, but I will prefer if you finish chapt 9 and 10 first
- "Portal...?" I meant the teleportation portal in chapt 2, 5, 6, 7, 8
- "4 boxes not enough?" I tot it was 6? Anyway it wasnt really enough for Phodom, since he has two chapters dedicated to him only. But it's my opinion.
- "The campaign is not build like Diablo; this is a single-player RPG where you exactly know where to obtain each item so you don't need to grind forever to obtain some specific items." Hmm I understand your need to make things predictable. Allright I wont suggest luck-based mechanisms then. hahaha

Is it allright if we revived dead posts from several months/years ago, especially ideas? I browsed through the idea factory and saw some that I liked...
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on October 01, 2012, 02:57:19 am
It's hard really follow the conversation because you don't use any quotes and the answer are a bit confusing.

Anyway.

Yes it's fine to necropost. I don't mind.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on October 12, 2012, 09:35:46 am
Just played on Normal now and I find little difference in the difficulty of the game as compared to easy. I suggest that other than increasing enemy units' damage, you can or you may already:

- Increase hp, hp regen, attack speed, armor of enemy units
- Decrease gold and exp gained from killing enemy units
- Increase cost of buying items and recipes and books from stores
- Increase damage and frequency of bosses' spells, mini-events and events
- Add more spells, mini-events and events for bosses
- If something requires a time limit like fighting epic boss chapter 3, shorten the time
- More demanding quests and more quests
- More mini-bosses and enemy units
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Pourquoi on October 12, 2012, 10:05:26 am
Quote
- Increase cost of buying items and recipes and books from stores
This is not possible since item costs are all hardcoded.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on October 12, 2012, 02:48:46 pm
Just played on Normal now and I find little difference in the difficulty of the game as compared to easy. I suggest that other than increasing enemy units' damage, you can or you may already:

- Increase hp, hp regen, attack speed, armor of enemy units
- Decrease gold and exp gained from killing enemy units
- Increase cost of buying items and recipes and books from stores
- Increase damage and frequency of bosses' spells, mini-events and events
- Add more spells, mini-events and events for bosses
- If something requires a time limit like fighting epic boss chapter 3, shorten the time
- More demanding quests and more quests
- More mini-bosses and enemy units

Suggestions are good, but you also need to decide what to do with the other difficulties. If we do all this for normal we need to look at hard and extreme and what effect it will have there too.

But yes normal is too similar to easy :)
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on October 12, 2012, 11:07:45 pm
Suggestions are good, but you also need to decide what to do with the other difficulties. If we do all this for normal we need to look at hard and extreme and what effect it will have there too.
But yes normal is too similar to easy :)

What I meant is that the increases I mention can be progressive as difficulty gets harder. Like more and more armor for each monster as I proceed from easy to normal to hard to extreme and to ****
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: hamza_tm on October 13, 2012, 05:38:36 am
Suggestions are good, but you also need to decide what to do with the other difficulties. If we do all this for normal we need to look at hard and extreme and what effect it will have there too.
But yes normal is too similar to easy :)

What I meant is that the increases I mention can be progressive as difficulty gets harder. Like more and more armor for each monster as I proceed from easy to normal to hard to extreme and to ****

Yes agreed, but if you look at extreme difficult at the moment, it is pretty good in terms of how hard it is and adding more stuff like armour etc will only make it frustratingly grinding.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on October 30, 2012, 04:06:33 am
Just played on Normal now and I find little difference in the difficulty of the game as compared to easy. I suggest that other than increasing enemy units' damage, you can or you may already:

- Increase hp, hp regen, attack speed, armor of enemy units
- Decrease gold and exp gained from killing enemy units
- Increase cost of buying items and recipes and books from stores
- Increase damage and frequency of bosses' spells, mini-events and events
- Add more spells, mini-events and events for bosses
- If something requires a time limit like fighting epic boss chapter 3, shorten the time
- More demanding quests and more quests
- More mini-bosses and enemy units

I like the gold and exp thing.

Easy: -10% Exp & Gold
Normal: -20% Exp & Gold
Hard: -30% Exp & Gold
Extreme: -40% Exp & Gold
****: -50% Exp & Gold
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Pourquoi on October 30, 2012, 08:04:50 am
Yeah, reducing the gold gained? So we'll be forced to grind EVEN more?
Tsk. Not a good thing.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: manstein on October 30, 2012, 08:22:21 am
Quote
Yeah, reducing the gold gained? So we'll be forced to grind EVEN more?
Tsk. Not a good thing.

I have to agree with Pourquoi. Gold is always a short resource and as Gemstones and recipes for synthesis items cost already very much I think it is not advisable nor fair to the player to reduce the gold income.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on October 31, 2012, 05:17:21 am
Hmm, I see.

What does liauyuancheng think?

Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on October 31, 2012, 07:50:47 am
Hmm, its quite true that if gold is reduced at higher difficulties, then it makes things too difficult, possibly. I suggest for the creator to make a poll for people to vote what they want.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on January 11, 2013, 01:37:38 am
May I suggest

- Element system:
There could be several elements: fire, ice, electricity, nature, earth, light, darkness, air. An element can be attached to all bosses, all spells from characters and bosses and some items. So there could be a way whereby an element causes amplified damage on another element and reduced damage on another element. Like this: Light > Darkness > Ice > Fire > Nature > Earth > Electricity> Air> Light. This means that all spells are more effective at certain bosses and less effective at other bosses. Phodom could be fire; fradz electricity and galeoth ice. And items can have special effects that imbue certain elements to the owner or activates a spell that is element-based.

- Race system:
Each enemy unit can be attached to a race. So items can have special effects that increases or decreases damage to certain specific races. Spells can also work the same way.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: goku94 on January 13, 2013, 10:11:57 am
Element system might be a quite good thing, but the chain of elements would have to, well, make more sense. Cast Ice on Fire, and the Ice just melts. Blow wind in fire and the fire expands. Cover it with earth and it evaporates. It would have to be more like a web. Fire kills darkness, lightning kills darkness for some time, but darkness doesn't kill anything - so it would be the weakest one. Besides, if the system would be complex, there would have to be virtually everything included - poison, water, etc. If the system would be simple, and there would only be fire, water, wind and earth - it would make no sense.

The elements were used by philosophers 2700 years ago as a method to describe how the matter is built. Those concepts were on a child level by today's standards, so they are very faulty, inefective and nonpractical. The system would have to be based on something else, not just classical elements.

The Race system also sounds interesting, but there are so many races in this game: take wusses (or something), momos, boars, ice beasts, strange plant-like predators, normal animals, demons, dragons, humen, murloc, kazas. This is also way to complicated.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on January 14, 2013, 05:09:35 am
I tried elemental type of system but as changing attack types is too complicated and doesn't work well with systems I've created I abandoned the project.

I don't know about races... Because most races you won't face in the following chapters so I feel like this isn't a good idea.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 17, 2013, 01:59:25 am
It would be great if there could be a demonstration of the spell selected before one chooses it during the Prologue. And it would be good if the possible range of the spell selected be seen by a green circle, similar to Dota 2.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on March 17, 2013, 04:35:29 am
It is possible to do an arena to the prologue to test your chosen abilities.

About that range thing, I haven't played Dota 2 so you must show me what you're talking about.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 17, 2013, 10:53:32 am
The range indicator is shown in the attachment. And I also like to suggest that all bosses, mini-bosses, elite and epic bosses, as well as the characters, to shout the name of the spell they are casting. It'll be quite cool IMHO :)
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 17, 2013, 10:56:28 am
Also is it possible to add items that can reduce cooldown of spells, itemcosts etc. And I would like to suggest a new passive: Penetration - x% chance for an attack to ignore the armor of the enemy.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on March 17, 2013, 11:38:41 am
The range indicator is shown in the attachment. And I also like to suggest that all bosses, mini-bosses, elite and epic bosses, as well as the characters, to shout the name of the spell they are casting. It'll be quite cool IMHO :)
It is very possible to do both.

Also is it possible to add items that can reduce cooldown of spells, itemcosts etc. And I would like to suggest a new passive: Penetration - x% chance for an attack to ignore the armor of the enemy.

It is not possible to reduce cooldown time. It is against basics Warcraft 3 of functions.

I can do that the X damage ignores armor but I cannot do the basic attack ignores armor.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 18, 2013, 01:46:03 am
Ok thanks hope you will implement these cool features in the coming versions :)))
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 20, 2013, 09:05:15 pm
I find some stuff in Chapter 9 too easy, mainly: the fights against the death knights, the multi-colour crystal cave quest, the escort quest and the Axobada quest. My suggestions on how to increase the difficulty of these quests/fights:
- Death knight fights: Increase hp and attack, add more spells and events cause death knights, I thought, were suppose to be very strong such that they can kill Dragon Slayers.
- Crystal cave quest: Change the crystal to be destroyed into a new mini-boss that can use spells and cast events, one of which could be summoning of crystal golems. And when it is at critical hp, it could continuously summon golems, so the characters need to finish it off before too many golems are spawned.
- Axobada quest: Have several (like 10) random, independent electric orbs floating around the arena. If they touch a monster, it is healed to full hp. If they touch Fradz, they can deal high damage to him. Makes it more difficult to finish the quest and Fradz now cant just stand on one spot to kill the monsters.
- Escort quest: Have some ambushes by the golems or ancient creeps along the way, as the two NPCs are walking. So Galeoth need to tank the damage and quickly kill the monsters while the other NPCs are protected. When they are at the second cave, there could be a mini-boss guarding it, so Galeoth needs to fight and kill it to allow access to the second cave.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 20, 2013, 09:11:24 pm
Another suggestion: to have a tooltip in the NPC that explains the upgrade system of spell books. Now, while only one upgrade is imparted into each spell, we can change the upgrade anytime we want, at the cost of 5 honour points. This is necessary because I was misleaded into thinking that both upgrades will be imparted into each spell, wasting my honour points :((((

Also, why not we have scrolls that can be dropped by mini-bosses, bosses, elite and epic bosses that can be used on an item to increase the stats of the item, buffing it? That'll be quite cool and makes things personalised.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Pourquoi on March 20, 2013, 11:09:17 pm
Quote
Also, why not we have scrolls that can be dropped by mini-bosses, bosses, elite and epic bosses that can be used on an item to increase the stats of the item, buffing it? That'll be quite cool and makes things personalised.
Since WC3 items are static, if you were to make 'upgrades' for items, you have to make a new item for every upgrade, which will surely bloat the maps even more.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Doomlord on March 21, 2013, 12:08:31 am
My CSS system is capable of doing that. However the item aspect of the campaign is completed and Aero won't use it :v
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 21, 2013, 03:11:30 am
Two more random suggestions:

- To have a status icon to shown when a hero is mediating. Helps me not to move them while they're doing so.
- For Chapter 9, the cinematics involving the fight against many death knights, could it be changed into a main quest with a mini boss, in this case, a Death Knight or two to be defeated, either individually or as the whole team, something like Chapter 8's. That'll be more fun! :)))
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on March 21, 2013, 03:46:53 am
I find some stuff in Chapter 9 too easy, mainly: the fights against the death knights, the multi-colour crystal cave quest, the escort quest and the Axobada quest. My suggestions on how to increase the difficulty of these quests/fights:
- Death knight fights: Increase hp and attack, add more spells and events cause death knights, I thought, were suppose to be very strong such that they can kill Dragon Slayers.

Easily done I increased their health and attack damage. Creating new events and spells takes a lot time as I will have to create the ideas first. If you have ideas, post them.

- Crystal cave quest: Change the crystal to be destroyed into a new mini-boss that can use spells and cast events, one of which could be summoning of crystal golems. And when it is at critical hp, it could continuously summon golems, so the characters need to finish it off before too many golems are spawned.

I don't want another mini-boss for Phodom or things go out of balance. For each character two mini-bosses. I'm satisfied with the current amount of bosses in the chapter. One thing that I might still add is second phase of the main storyline boss which will be optional. This also includes the puzzle I never created for the chapter.

- Axobada quest: Have several (like 10) random, independent electric orbs floating around the arena. If they touch a monster, it is healed to full hp. If they touch Fradz, they can deal high damage to him. Makes it more difficult to finish the quest and Fradz now cant just stand on one spot to kill the monsters.

It is true now your tactic is simply to find a perfect spot where you stand. I can create these orbs easily, however. Will be done.

- Escort quest: Have some ambushes by the golems or ancient creeps along the way, as the two NPCs are walking. So Galeoth need to tank the damage and quickly kill the monsters while the other NPCs are protected. When they are at the second cave, there could be a mini-boss guarding it, so Galeoth needs to fight and kill it to allow access to the second cave.

I'll do something about this. You'll see.

Another suggestion: to have a tooltip in the NPC that explains the upgrade system of spell books. Now, while only one upgrade is imparted into each spell, we can change the upgrade anytime we want, at the cost of 5 honour points. This is necessary because I was misleaded into thinking that both upgrades will be imparted into each spell, wasting my honour points :((((

Okay.

Quote
Also, why not we have scrolls that can be dropped by mini-bosses, bosses, elite and epic bosses that can be used on an item to increase the stats of the item, buffing it? That'll be quite cool and makes things personalised.
Since WC3 items are static, if you were to make 'upgrades' for items, you have to make a new item for every upgrade, which will surely bloat the maps even more.
Yep, yep. I try my best to avoid this.

My CSS system is capable of doing that. However the item aspect of the campaign is completed and Aero won't use it :v
Yes, yes. No need to advertise this I'm not going to use it in the campaign.  ::)

- To have a status icon to shown when a hero is mediating. Helps me not to move them while they're doing so.
What do you mean status icon?

- For Chapter 9, the cinematics involving the fight against many death knights, could it be changed into a main quest with a mini boss, in this case, a Death Knight or two to be defeated, either individually or as the whole team, something like Chapter 8's. That'll be more fun! :)))

What? You'll fight against all the death knights in chapter 10 again in a team battle. Including Zylcious himself.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Doomlord on March 21, 2013, 05:08:47 am
My CSS system is capable of doing that. However the item aspect of the campaign is completed and Aero won't use it :v
Yes, yes. No need to advertise this I'm not going to use it in the campaign.  ::)

Seriously, there is no need to put it like that. I am just pointing out a fact, not advertising. Besides, who would be my target? People here don't know how to make maps or code. Could you advertise a product where ppl don't even know what it is?

Furthermore, I will be highly appreciative if you are to stop criticizing me on every possible occasion. I was helping YOU, not competing with.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on March 21, 2013, 05:53:17 am
Actually if you want to continue this conversation make a thread. Otherwise let's stop this.

Here was my comment until I decided to hide it.

Spoiler (hover to show)
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Doomlord on March 21, 2013, 06:38:16 am
I don't want to make a ruckus but here is my last statement.

Spoiler (hover to show)

Anyway if you want to continue, feel free to send me a PM.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 21, 2013, 06:45:36 am
I find some stuff in Chapter 9 too easy, mainly: the fights against the death knights, the multi-colour crystal cave quest, the escort quest and the Axobada quest. My suggestions on how to increase the difficulty of these quests/fights:
- Death knight fights: Increase hp and attack, add more spells and events cause death knights, I thought, were suppose to be very strong such that they can kill Dragon Slayers.

Easily done I increased their health and attack damage. Creating new events and spells takes a lot time as I will have to create the ideas first. If you have ideas, post them.

Well, I was thinking that since they are Death Knights, they could have somewhat similar dark spells that are used by all Death Knights. On top of that, for Enthan, you could have spells that Phodom can have, like Chaotic Realm (with the debuff!!!), fire elemental, spinning death, impact flare, meltdown, headbutt, soulburn, flame explosion, colossal slam and /or ground zero. As for the other death knight, well, you could use fradz's spells (if he's lightning type - cant remember because I pwned him too quickly), like thunder, discharge, double wave, scissor stab, teleport strike, flash strike, mystic storm, lightning orb, lightning elemental, invisible strike, energy ball and/or lightning storm.

- Crystal cave quest: Change the crystal to be destroyed into a new mini-boss that can use spells and cast events, one of which could be summoning of crystal golems. And when it is at critical hp, it could continuously summon golems, so the characters need to finish it off before too many golems are spawned.

I don't want another mini-boss for Phodom or things go out of balance. For each character two mini-bosses. I'm satisfied with the current amount of bosses in the chapter. One thing that I might still add is second phase of the main storyline boss which will be optional. This also includes the puzzle I never created for the chapter.

Wait u mean the single monster in the crystal cave before the quest is initiated is a mini-boss? LOL I pwned it too quickly again so I tot it was just a normal creep. Hmmm if you say so, but the quest isnt really challenging as I tot it will be in Chapter 9. Just saying.

Anyway great that you're adding more stuff to Chapter 9! :)

- Axobada quest: Have several (like 10) random, independent electric orbs floating around the arena. If they touch a monster, it is healed to full hp. If they touch Fradz, they can deal high damage to him. Makes it more difficult to finish the quest and Fradz now cant just stand on one spot to kill the monsters.

It is true now your tactic is simply to find a perfect spot where you stand. I can create these orbs easily, however. Will be done.

That'll be great! :DDD

- Escort quest: Have some ambushes by the golems or ancient creeps along the way, as the two NPCs are walking. So Galeoth need to tank the damage and quickly kill the monsters while the other NPCs are protected. When they are at the second cave, there could be a mini-boss guarding it, so Galeoth needs to fight and kill it to allow access to the second cave.

I'll do something about this. You'll see.

Mind sharing what you want to do? :P

- To have a status icon to shown when a hero is mediating. Helps me not to move them while they're doing so.
What do you mean status icon?

Like when you have a buff, e.g. Blessing of Lightning, the icon shows after the "Status:" at the bottom of the hero information about damage, armor, stats etc. So I was hoping that the meditate icon can also appear when meditating.

- For Chapter 9, the cinematics involving the fight against many death knights, could it be changed into a main quest with a mini boss, in this case, a Death Knight or two to be defeated, either individually or as the whole team, something like Chapter 8's. That'll be more fun! :)))

What? You'll fight against all the death knights in chapter 10 again in a team battle. Including Zylcious himself.

Oh if that's the case, we could have Phodom soloing one Death Knight, and the same goes for Fradz and Galeoth and the three must defeat the Death Knights independently.

What happened to the other three Dragon Slayers? o.o
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: CoNteMpT on March 28, 2013, 12:30:33 pm
this topic somehow got out of hand, but whatever.

i do have a minor suggestion for galeoth healing light or whatever its called.
the basic spell used for it is inner fire if i am not mistaken, so wc3 uses the autocast AI for inner fire that is actually horrible for a heal spell. can you just remake this spell with the priests "heal" spell as basic spell? you can even remove the 5 damage and armor, they dont scale and nobody will miss them anyways, but like that we at least are able to use the autocast in a good way.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 28, 2013, 08:29:40 pm
Out of hand? And yeah 5 armor is insignificant late game.... Should just make Inner Fire a pure healing spell without buffing the hero
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 31, 2013, 04:08:16 am
Random feedback: For the random hints in the game, can you remove the hints that talk about vitality and food? This system has been removed some versions ago....
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on March 31, 2013, 08:33:16 am
Random feedback: For the random hints in the game, can you remove the hints that talk about vitality and food? This system has been removed some versions ago....
Where is vitality texts?

And I want something else than a simple healing spell.

About the death knights I have added now some improvements I will do in the future.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 31, 2013, 10:43:57 am
Random feedback: For the random hints in the game, can you remove the hints that talk about vitality and food? This system has been removed some versions ago....
Where is vitality texts?

And I want something else than a simple healing spell.

About the death knights I have added now some improvements I will do in the future.

Its in the random hint that is shown when one clicks on the icon 'Show random hint'. It talks about importance of maintaining high lvl of vitality by consuming food regularly. And Phodom's set gives 20 vitality too, pls remove it.

Another suggestion: I have listed some spells/events/systems you can use for boss fights previously. You can use to improve your boss and mini-boss fights as you wish. I find that the bosses and mini-bosses are tad too easy as they usually have only 1 spell in effect.... Unlike epic and elite bosses which have enough spells and events to deal with. Do add more spells/events for bosses and mini bosses, especially for later levels.

What about the achievement and weather system? o.o
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: CoNteMpT on March 31, 2013, 04:13:01 pm
Random feedback: For the random hints in the game, can you remove the hints that talk about vitality and food? This system has been removed some versions ago....
Where is vitality texts?

And I want something else than a simple healing spell.

About the death knights I have added now some improvements I will do in the future.

well dude it gives +5 armor and damage right now, that IS a simple healing spell but based on "inner fire", so it has a horrendous autocast-AI.

if you base the spell no the priests "heal" then i wont mind the effect at all. just if you give it any autocast, give it one that actually is usefull. and it WOULD be usefull.
my suggestion would be to give the target invulnerability for 1 second. that way you could use it to make a target lose aggro, dodge an enemy spell or dispell effects from him. very versatile. also if its based on the priests heal, its amazing.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on March 31, 2013, 08:39:53 pm
We could have a healing spell that casts a buff on a hero. Whenever the buffed hero is about to receive damage, he will be healed by the amount of damage to be received and the damage will be negated, for a certain duration. This wont work if the damage is more than the current hp of the hero.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on April 11, 2013, 02:47:18 am
What weather system? I thought this idea was long time ago discussed and in the end we came to a conclusion it's pretty pointless. I mean different positive / negative stats based on the weather.

Quote from: CoNteMpT
my suggestion would be to give the target invulnerability for 1 second. that way you could use it to make a target lose aggro, dodge an enemy spell or dispell effects from him. very versatile. also if its based on the priests heal, its amazing.

Okay, so heal, armor, magic damage + 1 sec inv? Sounds pretty overpowered for me.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on April 11, 2013, 09:11:17 am
What weather system? I thought this idea was long time ago discussed and in the end we came to a conclusion it's pretty pointless. I mean different positive / negative stats based on the weather.

Quote from: CoNteMpT
my suggestion would be to give the target invulnerability for 1 second. that way you could use it to make a target lose aggro, dodge an enemy spell or dispell effects from him. very versatile. also if its based on the priests heal, its amazing.

Okay, so heal, armor, magic damage + 1 sec inv? Sounds pretty overpowered for me.

I think he means a heal and 1 sec invulnerability to remove any aggro on the hero, without bonuses to armor and magic dmg. What about my suggestion for the healing spell as above?
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on April 12, 2013, 03:33:04 am
Well, it is possible. I think the invulnerable thing with an auto-cast ability can be also annoying so I don't want to use that idea. I mean when you're fighting and Galeoth cast the spell on Phodom the aggro goes away then the enemy for example starts to attack Fradz or Galeoth. No, no, no.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on April 12, 2013, 05:23:26 am
Then the spell shouldn't be autocastable anyway it's cooldown should be longer - 10 sec? To prevent too much use of invulnerability
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on April 12, 2013, 06:30:54 am
I can't change the ability from auto-cast to something now after it's made. If it's auto-cast, then it's auto-cast. :(
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on April 12, 2013, 06:07:42 pm
Ok or this could be an alternative healing spell for galeoth xd
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on April 18, 2013, 05:43:17 am
Heal + invulnerable?
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on April 18, 2013, 09:16:31 am
Yeah for like a few seconds
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on April 19, 2013, 06:10:20 am
All the abilities are filled now. But maybe there's an existing ability that could use your idea? It is interesting and haven't been used before.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on April 19, 2013, 10:32:47 am
Why not change inner light to this ability?
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on April 23, 2013, 05:04:27 am
Because it is already created and it would disappear for many people if I would change the ability so suddenly.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on April 23, 2013, 06:50:08 am
I actually could still do one change if you really want; I could change this heal to your heal.

4. Crystal Rune

Places a crystal Rune on any unit that increases armor if friendly ordecreases armor if enemy. After 5 seconds the rune detonates, dealing area toenemies and healing allies.
|c00FEBA0EHotkey: E.
Type: Area.
Cooldown: 10 seconds.
|c00E55BB0Armor is based on Ability Level. Each level gives 2 armor. Damage is based on Ability Level and Magic Damage. Each level increases the damage by
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on April 23, 2013, 09:02:10 am
Hmmm I suggest that you create a straw poll on the current 5 healing spells for Galeoth and allow people to choose their favorites?
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on April 23, 2013, 09:41:16 am
There are only 4x abilities per category.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on April 23, 2013, 11:41:30 am
Yes I was thinking the top 4 favorite healing spell be chosen for the campaign
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: Aeroblyctos on April 23, 2013, 02:21:50 pm
I created this. Are you happy?


Crystal Plane

Galeoth can momentarily put a targeted friendly unit to half dimension making untargetable by enemies for 3 seconds. Afterwards as it comes back it is healed and for 3 seconds its Evasion and Magic Resistance are increased by 50%.
Title: Re: liauyuancheng
Post by: liauyuancheng on April 23, 2013, 06:34:57 pm
Okk sure but I don't want to be seen as forcing u to make this spell. Anyway thx! ;)