Author Topic: Official Balance Thread  (Read 3451 times)

Doomlord

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Official Balance Thread
« on: March 19, 2013, 08:57:53 am »
Here is a thread for discussing unbalanced elements in the Campaign.

I will start first as the OP.

Magical Hammer basically surpasses all other abilities in the same category with its multiple benefits including mana burn, stun, aoe damage in return for landing a successful hit with a unit target and a delay of 1 sec. I dare to say that no player would bother selecting a different ability during any of their playthroughs.

My suggestions:

A/ Move it to the AoE category.

B/ Nerf it as you see fit.

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liauyuancheng

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2013, 11:12:56 pm »
I think that the magic aura is a bit overpowered. In Chapter 1, I had 2 magic balls and abrey, so my magic dmg summed up into 350. This means that I deal around 300 damage per 3 sec to enemies around with my aura, OHKO most normal creeps :)

Aeroblyctos

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2013, 11:35:04 pm »
If you've 350 Magic Damage and level 5 Magic Aura it means you deal 87,5 damage per 3 second. Not that much.

liauyuancheng

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2013, 11:49:35 pm »
But it's also based on level of hero, no?

Aeroblyctos

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2013, 05:05:55 am »
Noooope.

liauyuancheng

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2013, 07:15:50 am »
????? The description says so....

Aeroblyctos

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #6 on: April 03, 2013, 03:31:14 am »
????? The description says so....
Okay, I will check it out.

Ancient Mob

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #7 on: May 20, 2013, 04:45:45 pm »
well I think that in campaign the usage of int and magic damage is more then it should be. All the heroes have lots of places where there is need of int or magic damage. I mean it was ok to use int & magic damage for spell book. & some spells of character. But int usage in character's set was not good.
Here is my int phodom skill set which gives a very strong combo
1-DEFENSIVE ROAR
2-MELTDOWN
3-FLAME EXPLOSION
4-SHIELD OF FIRE
5-AURA OF FIRE
6-CHAOTIC RIFT
Imho this skill build is ideal for current phodom.
So if i make a little combination of few things from campaign, the int phodom is unbalanced
If u combine the aura of fire + magic aura + phodom's set + zocmo's set/unholy cloak/ring of thunder(the idea here is the invisiblity) you can easily kill bosses without even hitting them. & also shield of fire also goes with the combo. and as we are playing with int phodom our spell book spells are also more powerfull. And your skill build is also gets more powerfull then strength skill build. & there are lots of things which makes int phodom way too powerfull then strength phodom. & I also got disappointed when I saw that in fradz's set int attribute was being used again. so, I wanna suggest you that there should be equal importance of each attribute. And more spells should be added based on their primary attributes. Hope you get my point.

Aeroblyctos

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2013, 06:00:27 am »
So if i make a little combination of few things from campaign, the int phodom is unbalanced
If u combine the aura of fire + magic aura + phodom's set + zocmo's set/unholy cloak/ring of thunder(the idea here is the invisiblity) you can easily kill bosses without even hitting them.
Does they hit back to you?

Yea I get the point but you didn't gave me any idea how to fix the problem. If it's even the problem. I've been thinking that it's in the end fine. I mean you can't make all your characters magic based so you're forced to have maximum of 2 characters magic damage based.

TrueZozi

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2013, 08:26:00 am »
So if i make a little combination of few things from campaign, the int phodom is unbalanced
If u combine the aura of fire + magic aura + phodom's set + zocmo's set/unholy cloak/ring of thunder(the idea here is the invisiblity) you can easily kill bosses without even hitting them.
Does they hit back to you?

Yea I get the point but you didn't gave me any idea how to fix the problem. If it's even the problem. I've been thinking that it's in the end fine. I mean you can't make all your characters magic based so you're forced to have maximum of 2 characters magic damage based.

Don't think that on the early stages of campaign you can benefit from it so much as it could be called "abuse". And from the stage when you got Phodom's Set (Ch.9!) it won't work as easily boss killing - bosses has a lot of events, and you've also got two other characters - I mean if Phodom's dmg is only aura dmg from invisibility - therefore there is no tank and you'r lose more lifes on such boss then if you'd use Phodom as tank/dd.
I mean that you can be sure that something is imbalanced only if you've tried it during the whole campaign and not in one and only situation.
For sure the campaign is nearly 99% balanced, exceptions are non significant (in my opinion).
The only one thing is that Lizard in Ch.9 (don't remember his name) and his devour ability - it kills too fast and has too fast cd - I suppose that atleast one of this features should be nerfed.
Other moments of campaign that affect on the gameplay significantly only connected with bugs (Aero's most hated work :-X).
« Last Edit: May 21, 2013, 08:28:01 am by TrueZozi »
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Aeroblyctos

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2013, 09:19:26 am »
Haha, don't lie to yourself I'm sure the campaign is far from balanced.

I can make that lizard thing easier if it's too hard.

- Eats a unit dealing 1500/2000/2500/3000 damage per second. Has 10 second cooldown.

To what?

Doomlord

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2013, 09:30:27 am »
Uhm Aero. Why did you ignore my post?

Aeroblyctos

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2013, 11:20:18 am »
I've ignored 99% of sent post to me last 2 weeks. I haven't yet fully recovered.  :o

Ancient Mob

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2013, 01:44:10 pm »
So if i make a little combination of few things from campaign, the int phodom is unbalanced
If u combine the aura of fire + magic aura + phodom's set + zocmo's set/unholy cloak/ring of thunder(the idea here is the invisiblity) you can easily kill bosses without even hitting them.
Does they hit back to you?

Yea I get the point but you didn't gave me any idea how to fix the problem. If it's even the problem. I've been thinking that it's in the end fine. I mean you can't make all your characters magic based so you're forced to have maximum of 2 characters magic damage based.
No ofc they can't hit me back..they just run like helpless chickens  ;D
I don't get your point of forcing to playthorough a specific way. I mean i don't have problem in playing that way..As i gave up & now trying int phodom. & trust me he is op. But i feel unfair for strength phodom. & its not just 2 chars.. all three of them are overpower if they go for int build. If you want i can show you unbalance in int & agi fradz also. & I don't know if you made u unholy cloak's invisibility intentionally or its bug...

Don't think that on the early stages of campaign you can benefit from it so much as it could be called "abuse". And from the stage when you got Phodom's Set (Ch.9!) it won't work as easily boss killing - bosses has a lot of events, and you've also got two other characters - I mean if Phodom's dmg is only aura dmg from invisibility - therefore there is no tank and you'r lose more lifes on such boss then if you'd use Phodom as tank/dd.
I mean that you can be sure that something is imbalanced only if you've tried it during the whole campaign and not in one and only situation.
For sure the campaign is nearly 99% balanced, exceptions are non significant (in my opinion).
The only one thing is that Lizard in Ch.9 (don't remember his name) and his devour ability - it kills too fast and has too fast cd - I suppose that atleast one of this features should be nerfed.
Other moments of campaign that affect on the gameplay significantly only connected with bugs (Aero's most hated work :-X).

well i noticed this unbalance in chapter 6. And then decided to give up & start again from chapter one..you won't believe me but now iam having hard time to get permanent attribute bonus from ruby axe & magartha's set...As everything dies way too fast.. I also like playing op heroes..but its not good for campaign to be unbalanced..& in chapter 6 killing zor'zo/ xod /dark messiah was child's play.. & btw at that time i was playing phodom as tank & strength.. So i didn't had int spells. I had all strength based spells. Except aura of fire. then i got idea of combining invisibility & passive area damage. I had aura of fire lvl 1.. I gave magic balls & other magic damage items to phodom just to check that how it works. You won't believe me its was damm easy. All I did is gave unholy cloak to phodom as it gives you permanent invisibility. Just click Z on target. & go for snack break. When you come back you'll see that poor mini bosses are dead. & btw why would I'll use my other 2 characters if I have 1 op char. I didn't used even fire cloak or didn't had high level aura of fire at that time. & btw even if I have to use all there chars I can make my whole team invisible, right from chapter 6. Where all char meet.
1.Fradz-invisible strike
2.Phodom-unholy cloak
3.galeoth-zocmo's set
Idk why you don't get the point.
Its very unbalanced.
Anybody can exploit the magic damage build.
Just give all chars magic aura. & invisibility.
For phodom its not just magic aura. He can be op right from start. & do you know that you can buy fire cloak right from start. But i didn't bought because I was already having hard time in getting permanent stats from ruby axe & all. & you know how I got stats..?
I have to drop all magic damage giving items & use tank items so that bosses don't die easily. I spent more then half & hour at archmage just to get stats from hits. As he is only one who got heal. not just in chapter 1, in chapter 4 & 5 I use sunrise set items & ancient leaf & all that kind of defense stuff so I can get stats. As we can't turn off the effects of magic aura/aura of fire.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2013, 08:01:09 am by Shinokyofu »

TrueZozi

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Re: Official Balance Thread
« Reply #14 on: May 21, 2013, 03:28:31 pm »
Haha, don't lie to yourself I'm sure the campaign is far from balanced.

I can make that lizard thing easier if it's too hard.

- Eats a unit dealing 1500/2000/2500/3000 damage per second. Has 10 second cooldown.

To what?

Maybe increase cd to 30 seconds or add the chance to avoid his devour if you will step back in a correct moment when the lizard comes close (but its much more complicated) so I think that 30 seconds cd is a key.

For those how think that in some sets heroes are overpowered - you got op phodom or others after give up usage - but before you have to do a lot to earn sufficient amount of money (atleast Ch.6 I suppose), or you got them easy-walkthrough using invis-aura and afk... omg isn't it boring? If you think that in such battles (with normal creeps and mini-bosses) you'll easily benefit from such strategy - then why not to try **** when you don't have a chance to revive using lifes? Why do heroes in some complicated buildorders and ultimate sets have to be counted as overpowered? Don't forget that this campaign is not only for those how spend 10000 hours on it already but for the first-timers also.
In other words I mean if you know how to build really powerfull heroes - just use **** mode, the question about moving after the target with invisibility and burning it - it is even more boring than using cheats...
When I mentioned about using of all 3 characters - I meant special epic and elite events when such invisible tactics in most cases sucks hard.
If you'd nerf such things - you will found out that the campaign became completable only for the "some kind of experienced" players - no attraction for new-comers as it'd be too complicated.

P/S I'm pretty sure that I made a lot of mistakes in this post - sorry it is late night for me already
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